Posts by yoerik

1) Message boards : News : Rosetta's role in fighting coronavirus (Message 98675)
Posted 25 Aug 2020 by Profile yoerik
Post:
I see your points, and now that I have read them, I agree with them. The problem here is with R@h client's motivation. Many people donate willing and are fine with it. However, many people are just anxious for this pandemic to be over with and don't really understand the depths of the project. In my point of view, R@h lost a lot of potential users thanks to this gap in communication. The real issue here, is that thanks to this pandemic, R@h is probably getting more computational power than it probably will ever get. It behooves a project such as this to leverage this opportunity while this still is going on.
Just my opinion. Initially I targeted 1M Cobblestones as my final personal goal, now I'm going to 2M, and the highest motivational tool for this is the 'Gamefication' of BOINC with credits and ranks. Still, a regular update could cheer people up for longer periods.


I've been raising this issue here for awhile, now. Take 5 minutes to write 5 sentences about how things are going, and you are doing the absolute bare minimum. The sister project foldit, gets far more announcements and news than we do. It's not too much to ask... for something. At all. Just a two sentence: "There's no news to report, but we really appreciate your support. We will let you know when we have more developments to share."

Rephrase it slightly and post it once a month, until you have something to share.
Voila. It'll get annoying after awhile, but it's better than radio silence.
2) Message boards : Number crunching : For the betterment of BOINC (Message 98365)
Posted 28 Jul 2020 by Profile yoerik
Post:
That it will take me 3 months - after wasting months finding the correct resource share - is not user friendly

Did you mean to write months?
Because you were referring to a message that talked about running 3 of 4 cores on one project while running 1 of 4 on another, which implies to me throughout each day, not months.
I have no idea where "months" came from, nor their relevance. Resource shares certainly don't take months to resolve themselves.
The only timescales I'd think were relevant were cache sizes in days and deadlines.

I'm not great with the finer details of Boinc, but when I set my priorities between 2 projects (and I don't know how it works with more projects and with highly divergent deadlines tbf) the tasks that come down seem to reflect them.

Edit2: It also seems to be a highly user-unfriendly suggestion


Grant said:
And adjusting the Resource share also changes things, as does suspending/ restarting of tasks or projects, so it has to re-work things, yet again.
Having a low powered, low core count system with a (relatively) large cache setting, and running multiple projects means it will take months for things to settle down from the time you make your last change to the settings, and no further suspending/ restarting of tasks or projects. As soon as you change something, then it has to re-work things, yet again.

referring to the time it would take the client to balance out to where I want it to be.
I responded later on that it isn't user friendly to play around with the resource share for months until you find the magic number that gives you the result you want.
3) Message boards : Number crunching : For the betterment of BOINC (Message 98307)
Posted 24 Jul 2020 by Profile yoerik
Post:
One thing I see most of all asked in the Forums is 'why can't I set project A to run 1 task at a time and probect B to run 3 tasks at a time on my quad core pc and have it stay that way', they aren't talking Resource Share they are talking a per cpu core settings. Waaay too many people saying 'I want more of project B running but all I see is project A running for days on end'. Especially in this time of Pandemics and other crisis it would be nice to be able to crunch for both a Pandemic project and my favorite project at the same time full time, not swapping back and forth between them.

This!

I have to manually suspend and resume tasks to literally force the client to do something like this... and because it doesn't fetch work when a task is suspended - my queue is limited for that project. My computer can handle a larger queue - but it runs out every few days because of that additional requirement - necessary, but harmful because of this client-end limitation.

I think the answer is "stop wanting it".
It's an overly narrow perspective.
There's no difference between wanting 3+1 running at all times and running 12 of one then 4 of the other over a day, or 36 and 12 over 3 days of this project's deadlines.
Sure, there may be memory constraints of one project over another, as we occasionally see, but that's an entirely different matter.

To me (and I've given myself this rep and I stand by it) it's an example of contributors thinking projects exist for the benefit of the weird quirks of individual users, rather than users offering their capacity to projects for whatever the projects need us to run for them. A desire for the tail to wag the dog.
Well, that's not how it works, nor should work.

Whatever this suggestion even is, it's not for the betterment of Boinc, nor the betterment of individual projects.
So it's a no from me. To be more frank, it 's a "not ever".


BOINC needs to be as user friendly as possible. That it will take me 3 months - after wasting months finding the correct resource share - is not user friendly. Nevermind that it can be completely undone by a temporary WU shortage at any single project, or an issue with credits, completely resetting the process.

This is a volunteer project, and giving volunteers as much control over their contribution as possible isn't too much to ask. Just as it isn't too much to be kept informed about the impacts of the community's overall contribution - but that's a different issue. The point is - it isn't insane to ask the developers to add this to their bucketlist for the future, so that user control over their contribution remains a priority.
4) Message boards : Number crunching : For the betterment of BOINC (Message 98290)
Posted 23 Jul 2020 by Profile yoerik
Post:
I joined in March - and have adjusted resource share to attempt to get this result for over 2 months without manual intervention on the client end.

Because credit can vary between tasks, the resource share has tended to be fairly useless on my 4-core Pentium laptop.

Which is why it makes sense to have a setting, instead of playing with resource share in vain - putting you at the mercy of credit, which you have no control over - and has been discussed numerous times across this forum and others, how broken it can be.
5) Message boards : Number crunching : For the betterment of BOINC (Message 98273)
Posted 22 Jul 2020 by Profile yoerik
Post:
One thing I see most of all asked in the Forums is 'why can't I set project A to run 1 task at a time and probect B to run 3 tasks at a time on my quad core pc and have it stay that way', they aren't talking Resource Share they are talking a per cpu core settings. Waaay too many people saying 'I want more of project B running but all I see is project A running for days on end'. Especially in this time of Pandemics and other crisis it would be nice to be able to crunch for both a Pandemic project and my favorite project at the same time full time, not swapping back and forth between them.


This!

I have to manually suspend and resume tasks to literally force the client to do something like this... and because it doesn't fetch work when a task is suspended - my queue is limited for that project. My computer can handle a larger queue - but it runs out every few days because of that additional requirement - necessary, but harmful because of this client-end limitation.
6) Message boards : Number crunching : Tells us your thoughts on granting credit for large protein, long-running tasks (Message 97906)
Posted 4 Jul 2020 by Profile yoerik
Post:
that - and plenty of cities don't rely on fossil fuels for energy.
7) Message boards : Number crunching : Record days. (Message 97899)
Posted 4 Jul 2020 by Profile yoerik
Post:
credit isn't always perfect - and certainly isn't a perfect metric to track the work of the project.
8) Message boards : Number crunching : Problems and Technical Issues with Rosetta@home (Message 97832)
Posted 30 Jun 2020 by Profile yoerik
Post:
Follow-up to my previous post, just out of curiosity: Why would BOINC interrupt a work unit in progress to start another? I promise I'll hold off on questions now...
Eric


project weight can do that - also, that "switch projects every ____ minutes". Either can affect that - I've noticed the same thing with the same 2 projects.
9) Message boards : Number crunching : Problems and Technical Issues with Rosetta@home (Message 97782)
Posted 28 Jun 2020 by Profile yoerik
Post:
yeah. It's identical to BOINC, but the WCG team does thorough testing before updating their version of the BOINC software. So in theory, less likely to run into bugs.
10) Message boards : Number crunching : no new tasks? (Message 97670)
Posted 27 Jun 2020 by Profile yoerik
Post:
alas - WUs return. We'll have to wait and see how long it lasts.
11) Message boards : News : Outage notice (Message 97661)
Posted 26 Jun 2020 by Profile yoerik
Post:
I bumped my runtime from 8 hours to 12, just kicked in today. I'll have to wait and see how it goes. I have a large queue of World Community Grid in the interim.
12) Message boards : News : Outage notice (Message 97655)
Posted 26 Jun 2020 by Profile yoerik
Post:
yep, I managed to snag a few of those. Went through them rather quickly though - so I'm mainly getting resends right now.
13) Message boards : News : Outage notice (Message 97650)
Posted 26 Jun 2020 by Profile yoerik
Post:
We're all in the same boat, dude. The only WUs going out rn appear to be resends.
14) Message boards : Number crunching : no new tasks? (Message 97554)
Posted 24 Jun 2020 by Profile yoerik
Post:
the stats on the front page is a more accurate display of the supply. Hence, 80,000 as of 3:00 UTC is the most accurate number. The page you see the near-30k, is a gage of when we're near a shortage if the timing is right - but the rosetta@home homepage lists the full supply of Workunits.

And suspending WCG tasks bc of the client could be due to the deadline differences and/or resource share.
15) Message boards : Number crunching : no new tasks? (Message 97552)
Posted 24 Jun 2020 by Profile yoerik
Post:
Looks like about 30000 tasks ready to download. Some of my hosts that were out of work have started to pick some up, and I’m guessing I’ll have work across the board by morning.

per these stats:
https://boinc.bakerlab.org/rosetta/

80,000. Once inactive machines check in, those will be gone in the blink of an eye - which means more tasks need to come, or we'll be back at square one.
16) Message boards : Number crunching : No tasks (Message 97547)
Posted 23 Jun 2020 by Profile yoerik
Post:
my mistake - I was tired when writing, but cannot edit it.

I meant to say like - WCG. Not just, WCG.

I did link to another post with a list of all the options - but it is still a mistake. Thanks for pointing it out - my mind took a massive L there.
17) Message boards : Number crunching : Problems and Technical Issues with Rosetta@home (Message 97539)
Posted 23 Jun 2020 by Profile yoerik
Post:
Edit: Just noticed my work PC completed all Rosetta tasks already and buffers starting to be filled on two other machines ahead of completing remaining Rosetta tasks. All going as expected

You are lucky, or maybe are getting re-sends. One of my machines is starting to going dry. That is my concern. They may come back immediately, or not. You don't know. Good luck.


Why is it of concern? I look at it as a good thing that we completed the work load. Now there's little chunks coming in, they get taken immediately. Best for the science to get done rapidly than they have to wait until we finish it. I assume they've reached a key point in the research.

can't speak for other users, but I know for me that I'm less concerned about the shortage overall - moreso concerned by the continued lack of communication with volunteers since I joined in late march, 2020.
18) Message boards : Number crunching : Large numbers of tasks aborted by project killing CPU performance (Message 97538)
Posted 23 Jun 2020 by Profile yoerik
Post:
Just reading another book about black-hat hackers. It has got me to wondering if the real problem with Rosetta@home is that we've all been "recruited" for mining BitCoins or some similarly worthless task. That could actually be related to the push for more encryption, eh? Plus I see how it could explain the peculiar way the downloads were working, almost as though someone had imposed a paged memory system on the project, with data pages around half a GB each, notwithstanding large numbers of ostensibly different projects working on the same data.

Security is a chain, and the attackers are always looking for the weakest links. From reading the comments in this thread, some of which seem to be from honchos at Rosetta@home, the weak links seem pretty obvious...

Much as I disliked some of the management policies of WCG, it looks like I should switch back there. It might be amusing to find out if any of my suggestions were ever implemented,. Rosetta@home seems to have clearly crossed into the territory of even more poorly managed projects. I've seen a couple of references to WCG in threads here, and it's a long-term project with some degree of corporate support (even if IBM is only a shadow of the great company it was when I was young). (But I still think HP has fallen harder and faster...)

no comment on the security/bitcoin question - but I am also curious about your criticisms of WCG. A quick search of the WCG forums brought up your concern over a lack of a server status page - I just made a new thread bringing up the issue, thanks to you. https://www.worldcommunitygrid.org/forums/wcg/viewthread_thread,42562_lastpage,yes#631089

if there are any other concerns about that project, I would certainly appreciate it being brought back into the forums there.
19) Message boards : Number crunching : No tasks (Message 97517)
Posted 23 Jun 2020 by Profile yoerik
Post:
No problem. If you need any help setting up World Community Grid - post in their forums - and ask any questions you'd like. Hopefully Rosetta gets their queue back soon, so dedicated Rosetta users like you can keep crunching. In the interim - WCG is a good place (my primary project) - but it works as a secondary project as well.
20) Message boards : Number crunching : No tasks (Message 97515)
Posted 23 Jun 2020 by Profile yoerik
Post:
as cited in other threads https://boinc.bakerlab.org/rosetta/forum_thread.php?id=14060 - yep - there's a shortage. No word from anyone involved with the project on the shortage or how long it will last. The only solution on your end would be to run WCG's OpenPandemics - targeting COVID-19 treatments. They have million of WUs available for multiple subprojects, including OP.

Sorry. We're just going to have to wait until the WU queue returns to normal here, and if you want to keep your CPU busy - I strongly suggest WCG.


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