Problems and Technical Issues with Rosetta@home

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LouisD

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Message 104625 - Posted: 1 Feb 2022, 1:15:48 UTC - in response to Message 104622.  

Why aren't you getting pythons now? They're always available.


I am just the guy offering my computer. Not the guy who designed the system... I don't know what to answer here. If it becomes too complicated to help, help may just be driven away. That is my answer, but it is not really an answer, is it?
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Message 104626 - Posted: 1 Feb 2022, 1:18:26 UTC - in response to Message 104624.  

ah. This explains that. So I allowed in the computer details. But they lost some of my compute time now. This is what happens when helping becomes too complicated.
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Mr P Hucker
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Message 104627 - Posted: 1 Feb 2022, 1:26:52 UTC - in response to Message 104623.  

Virtual Box is not necessarily bad. But, in the Windows world I prefer Hyper-V (I run a few Windows Server 2019 Hyper-V servers) and in the Linux world, I like KVM better than Virtual Box. But I don't currently run productive KVM servers. Only test stuff. It is the plan that when Win Hyper-V server 2019 becomes unsupported, I will move VM's to a KVM server.

I feel that creating Virtual box VM's for BOINC is overkill and gross abuse of volunteered resources. Perhaps someone can explain, I might change mi mind if I am missing something here.

Anyway, thanks for your post. It was entertaining. :-)
Ask in LHC - I'm sure they said it's the only way they can get consistent reproduceable comparable results from more than one user. Must depend on the kind of work you're doing. Kryptos, which is now closed started with VB and tried to make native version, which is apparently harder.
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Message 104628 - Posted: 1 Feb 2022, 1:28:43 UTC - in response to Message 104626.  

ah. This explains that. So I allowed in the computer details. But they lost some of my compute time now. This is what happens when helping becomes too complicated.
To be fair they're probably having just as many difficulties at their end. It's a new thing for Rosetta, this VB stuff. But.... communication with the users could help both ends!
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Message 104629 - Posted: 1 Feb 2022, 7:31:10 UTC
Last modified: 1 Feb 2022, 7:48:28 UTC

There are three things that they can optimise for (not mutually exclusive):
1. Computer resources
2. Ease of use
3. Researcher's time

I think so far they're optimising #3 with VBox. I'd argue that the research is about as cutting edge as you can get (Nature's breakthrough and method of the year 2021) so I'm willing to put the effort in, but the reality is it could be a lot easier to run and that would lead to a lot more resources available.

And it wouldn't be difficult to improve communications, even is it's just once a week.
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Message 104630 - Posted: 1 Feb 2022, 12:52:56 UTC - in response to Message 104463.  

Take a look here https://www.manualslib.com/manual/1435811/Msi-X470-Gaming-Pro.html?page=32#manual and read the text to the side of the graphic.
I am in slot 2_1

As for slot 2_2 I am not sure what I have set up for SATA ports. I rarely go in there.
But I don't have much for SATA gear. DVD ROM and HDD and SDD I think.
So I could probably move them to other ports if 1 is not available.
Shit, I have the same board and wanted an M2 some day. Although mine has "plus max" on the end instead of "pro", not sure what that means.
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Message 104631 - Posted: 1 Feb 2022, 14:08:20 UTC - in response to Message 104628.  

there were additional issues overnight. I decided this morning that I would uninstall Virtual Box from my computer. As of now, my most capable computers are enlisted on World community grid, others will follow as time allows. If and when regular Rosetta tasks are available, they will process them. For now, I don't need the Virtual Box aggravation.
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Message 104632 - Posted: 1 Feb 2022, 15:51:26 UTC - in response to Message 104631.  

Some problems that people are having may be due to BOINC 7.18.1, the latest version on LocutusOfBorg.
Don't upgrade. I had to return to 7.16.6, the one from Ubuntu Software (or 7.16.17 works OK too).
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Mr P Hucker
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Message 104633 - Posted: 1 Feb 2022, 20:49:29 UTC - in response to Message 104632.  

Some problems that people are having may be due to BOINC 7.18.1, the latest version on LocutusOfBorg.
Don't upgrade. I had to return to 7.16.6, the one from Ubuntu Software (or 7.16.17 works OK too).
Why not just get it from Boinc themselves?
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Message 104634 - Posted: 1 Feb 2022, 22:08:10 UTC - in response to Message 104633.  

Why not just get it from Boinc themselves?

On Linux it may be easier to install it from a repository. It is different than Windows.
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Message 104638 - Posted: 1 Feb 2022, 23:05:01 UTC - in response to Message 104634.  
Last modified: 1 Feb 2022, 23:05:25 UTC

Why not just get it from Boinc themselves?

On Linux it may be easier to install it from a repository. It is different than Windows.
I've used it briefly, it seems to have some stupid thing like Google Play or Apple Store on phones. I don't use those either. I download from the website of the software I want. I hate things that try to take over. Putting that "friendly" stuff on Linux is just odd, that's the last place I'd expect to see that. So how do you know you're getting the latest version? Best to get things from the horse's mouth.
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Message 104639 - Posted: 1 Feb 2022, 23:23:30 UTC - in response to Message 104638.  

I knew that when I tried to warn people of something of relevance to the actual operation of the project I would get a lot of irrelevant comments.
And I had a pretty good idea of where they would come from.
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Message 104640 - Posted: 1 Feb 2022, 23:42:13 UTC - in response to Message 104639.  

I knew that when I tried to warn people of something of relevance to the actual operation of the project I would get a lot of irrelevant comments.
And I had a pretty good idea of where they would come from.
It's not irrelevant to point out Linux users have a lot more problems with Boinc. Are you too poor to buy Windows or something?
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Message 104641 - Posted: 2 Feb 2022, 20:16:44 UTC - in response to Message 104630.  

Take a look here https://www.manualslib.com/manual/1435811/Msi-X470-Gaming-Pro.html?page=32#manual and read the text to the side of the graphic.
I am in slot 2_1

As for slot 2_2 I am not sure what I have set up for SATA ports. I rarely go in there.
But I don't have much for SATA gear. DVD ROM and HDD and SDD I think.
So I could probably move them to other ports if 1 is not available.
Shit, I have the same board and wanted an M2 some day. Although mine has "plus max" on the end instead of "pro", not sure what that means.



Give up on a M.2 for BOINC. BOINC seems to hate them
I have had 2 and both did the same thing.
I have contacted Samsung EU and they will do some testing.
The store could do everything just fine with their test rig.
So it seems the software has an issue.
I can store stuff and partition and run CPU tasks off a M.2 but not GPU.
But firmware will not flash on a X470 with a 980 M.2
BOINC forum is lost. All the same checks and stuff I did they suggested.

I can give you a HWINFO64 HTML Gdrive link to the readout of my system and see if you can decode it, but that's about it. No one has answers.
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Message 104642 - Posted: 2 Feb 2022, 20:47:32 UTC - in response to Message 104641.  

Give up on a M.2 for BOINC. BOINC seems to hate them
I have had 2 and both did the same thing.
I have contacted Samsung EU and they will do some testing.
The store could do everything just fine with their test rig.
So it seems the software has an issue.
I can store stuff and partition and run CPU tasks off a M.2 but not GPU.
But firmware will not flash on a X470 with a 980 M.2
BOINC forum is lost. All the same checks and stuff I did they suggested.

I can give you a HWINFO64 HTML Gdrive link to the readout of my system and see if you can decode it, but that's about it. No one has answers.
I wonder if it's your board (which is worryingly similar to mine) or Boinc. Are Samsung going to try Boinc? Mind you not being able to flash it is also bad - are they going to use your model of board?
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Message 104643 - Posted: 3 Feb 2022, 7:19:01 UTC - in response to Message 104642.  

Give up on a M.2 for BOINC. BOINC seems to hate them
I have had 2 and both did the same thing.
I have contacted Samsung EU and they will do some testing.
The store could do everything just fine with their test rig.
So it seems the software has an issue.
I can store stuff and partition and run CPU tasks off a M.2 but not GPU.
But firmware will not flash on a X470 with a 980 M.2
BOINC forum is lost. All the same checks and stuff I did they suggested.

I can give you a HWINFO64 HTML Gdrive link to the readout of my system and see if you can decode it, but that's about it. No one has answers.
I wonder if it's your board (which is worryingly similar to mine) or Boinc. Are Samsung going to try Boinc? Mind you not being able to flash it is also bad - are they going to use your model of board?


I don't know. The chat CS people said they would pass all the info I gave them to the testing group.
It's up to them to figure out how to test things.

I should have the EVO next week. Just have to wait for the M.2 to get to the store.
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Message 104651 - Posted: 4 Feb 2022, 2:29:19 UTC - in response to Message 104609.  

[quote]It's tight, but if you go into Boinc Computing Preferences and on the Disk and Memory tab allow 95% for RAM, it should just about fit in the tasks asking for 3337.86Mb
Don't worry that it sounds a lot to give to Boinc. We've found the tasks generally don't use anything like that full amount in practise. It just allows you to get over this limit at the time of task launch.
I've put mine to 100%. It's only a rough guide anyway. Numberfields or something like that goes over what I ask. Most projects never reach it.

I didn't mention this at the time, but several months ago, pre VBox, when normal Rosetta tasks were asking for an inordinate amount of RAM before they'd start, I was asking the admins to cut back on the RAM demands (from 8 or 9Gb to something that would fit in a machine with only 4Gb RAM). They were reluctant and as part of my pleadings I was talking about how people were doing as much as they could to run tasks by increasing RAM and Disk space allocated to Boinc.

One of the points I made was one I got from you - that if it was possible to allocate 150% of RAM to Boinc, people would, because tasks never actually used that amount or anything near it while running - often less than 10% of it.

So, yes, allocating 100% of RAM to Boinc isn't actually the problem it might seem to be from a common-sense point of view.

I do try to pay attention, even to things that may appear a little crazy on the face of it
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Message 104652 - Posted: 4 Feb 2022, 2:56:43 UTC - in response to Message 104651.  

One of the points I made was one I got from you - that if it was possible to allocate 150% of RAM to Boinc, people would, because tasks never actually used that amount or anything near it while running - often less than 10% of it.
Well bugger me from behind, someone took me seriously. I'm actually a very intelligent person with 1000% common sense, which is probably why nobody else has it anymore.
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Sid Celery

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Message 104653 - Posted: 4 Feb 2022, 3:23:33 UTC - in response to Message 104652.  

One of the points I made was one I got from you - that if it was possible to allocate 150% of RAM to Boinc, people would, because tasks never actually used that amount or anything near it while running - often less than 10% of it.
Well bugger me from behind, someone took me seriously. I'm actually a very intelligent person with 1000% common sense, which is probably why nobody else has it anymore.

This is a very good example of your posts.
One sentence that makes sense, while another that no-one in their right mind would believe.
Just because most of what you write is nonsense doesn't detract from the germ of an idea that has something to it.
I'm a glass half-full person.
(Well, tbh I'm not, but for the purposes of this weird role I've given myself, I am)

My point at the time being, people get angry or upset when tasks don't or can't run because they're so eager and keen to be able to contribute their CPU time for the project, so anything that can be done to make it possible for them to contribute as much as possible makes it win-win for everyone. And they met us halfway.
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LouisD

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Message 104655 - Posted: 4 Feb 2022, 12:52:10 UTC - in response to Message 104641.  
Last modified: 4 Feb 2022, 13:06:04 UTC

Give up on a M.2 for BOINC. BOINC seems to hate them

I don't know. I have 3 computers running BOINC on M.2 drives. 2 on PCIE M.2, and one on a SATA M.2. All work fine . One is on Windows 11, two on Linux Mint 20.2 or 3. I had issues trying to run BOINC with Virtual Box on a Windows 10 computer, with 2.5 inch SATA SSD drives.


I am not saying that issues don't exist. But it is probably not M.2 per se. Possibly the type or brand of disk, the impolementation of the M.2 spec on the motherboard, or the driver. Similarly, I had issues with a cheap Chinese SSD (Foresee brand) that came bundled with my firewall hardware. It would simply not run FreeBSD (PFSense or OPNSense) correctly. Replacing the SSD with a cheap yet better one (Trancend) fixed the problem. The format was mSATA. Not exactly the same as an M.2 SATA, but the general idea applies.

Anyway, the issues could be with M.2 but more likely with something else revolving around the M.2 connexion such as the drive itself or the driver.

My 2 cents. hope it helps.
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